I'm going to break away from traditional poetry for a day and do "music as poetry"--because I do think some songs can count as poems
For example...
Bob Dylan, "Chimes of Freedom"
For some reason, it's ridiculously hard to find a version of Dylan singing this, so here's the Byrds:
Far between sundown's finish and midnight's broken toll
We ducked inside the doorway, as thunder went crashing
As majestic bells of bolts struck shadows in the sounds
Seeming to be the chimes of freedom flashing
Flashing for the warriors whose strength is not to fight
Flashing for the refugees on the unarmed road of flight
And for each and ev'ry underdog soldier in the night
And we gazed upon the chimes of freedom flashing.
Of course, I think a lot of Dylan's stuff is pure poetry, but that's just one example.
Emmylou Harris, "The Pearl"
Oh, the dragons are gonna fly tonight
They're circling low and inside tonight
It's another round in the losing fight
Out along the great divide tonight
We are aging soldiers in an ancient war
Seeking out some half remembered shore
We drink our fill and still we thirst for more
Asking if there's no heaven, what is this hunger for?
Our path is worn, our feet are poorly shod
We lift up our prayer against the odds
And fear the silence is the voice of God, of God, of God
Over the Rhine, "Jesus in New Orleans" (Also, I could listen only to Karin Bergquist's voice for the rest of my life and die a happy woman)
The last time I saw Jesus
I was drinking Bloody Marys in the South
In a barroom in New Orleans
Rinsin’ out the bad taste in my mouth
She wore a dark and faded blazer
With a little of the lining hanging out
When the jukebox played Miss Dorothy Moore
I knew that it was him without a doubt
Maybe this is just my brain running rampant with the 'identities' discussion over at Slacktiverse, but I'd be more confused by the idea that songs aren't poems than the suggestion that they are. Some of them may be bad poems, but the majority of non-musical poetry is probably not that great either. =)
ReplyDeleteAnd of course it's possible to make songs that are good but lose all their impact without music, and doubtless poems that can't be enriched with the addition of music. All of these here linked work nicely both ways - once I got to OTR, I just kept clicking through the rest of their songs that youtube suggested for the next couple of hours.
The main tension, I find, is in stories when songs are presented without music, because I have such a strong feeling that the author has a tune in their head and I know I'm not getting the full impact my trying to improvise at all. (Got to the bit in Hunger Games this morning where Katniss sings to Rue - powerful, beautiful, but I kept tripping up because I couldn't find a tune in my head that fit the rhythm of the words.)
I'm really glad you liked OTR. They're my favorite band.
ReplyDeleteI think you got to the core of what I was thinking here:
[[And of course it's possible to make songs that are good but lose all their impact without music, and doubtless poems that can't be enriched with the addition of music.]]
...I'm really having one of those days where my thoughts just will not come out coherently. Sorry. More later?
It's your blog; I'm not sure I can hold you accountable for not responding to comments as fast as I think you should. ;)
ReplyDeleteI recall well that OTR is your favourite - in fact, you and they are apparently so closely related in my memory that I forget to listen to them if we haven't talked recently. This isn't entirely a bad thing, because it means I get to discover them all over again on a regular basis.
I'm really gonna have to check out OTR soon; people keep recommending them and I keep forgetting. (And of course I can't just click right now, not from this machine.)
ReplyDeleteHave you heard Gillian Welch's songs? I think they're interesting because the tunes sound as if they could be traditional "mountain ballads," or the lyrics are based on images and characters from "old-timey music," but there's always something unexpected and original about them. As with other kinds of poetry, more is going on than first meets the eye, or ear.
I can't post video links from here, but this site give the lyrics for her most recent CD, The Harrow and the Harvest, and I believe most of them are easily findable on youtube.
Got to the bit in Hunger Games this morning where Katniss sings to Rue - powerful, beautiful, but I kept tripping up because I couldn't find a tune in my head that fit the rhythm of the words.
Huh. And it never occurred to me to try. I was perfectly happy to be left with a generic lullaby-ish impression. And now that you mention it, I can't think of any specific tune either.
I remember when I first read The Lord of the Rings, back in prehistory-- there are a lot of verses said to be "songs," but I was still quite surprised to come across attempts to set them to music.
I remember when I first read The Lord of the Rings, back in prehistory-- there are a lot of verses said to be "songs," but I was still quite surprised to come across attempts to set them to music.
ReplyDeleteThe first time I 'read' all of Tolkien's stuff was when I was extremely young and my father read them to me - he didn't so much sing the dwarves' song ("we must away 'ere break of day") as intone it, which seemed appropriate to dwarvish singing, and is actually quite close to how they're apparently doing it in the upcoming movie. Possibly this was imprinted on me, because I can't possibly read those lines without that incantationy effect, and I automatically try to set all written songs to a tune.
As I recall, Tolkien himself set a number to music, although I don't know if he intended such to be attempts or the official melodies.
My dad read The Lord of The Rings to my brother when my bro was little and used to make up tunes to the songs. To be honest, I never really got into Tolkien; I got bogged down in the details. Perhaps that's why I've avoided Moby Dick for most of my life.
ReplyDelete@Amaryllis: I love Gillian Welch! I've heard some of the songs on her new album, but I haven't bought it.
As for songs and poetry...I'm working this out as I go, because I'm not a musician (though I can sing fairly well) and I'm not a poet. But I think that, usually, songs are written in different ways from the way that poems are written, in that the music is intrinsic in the song. If you take the music away from a song, something essential is missing. Even the songs I posted--I can't read the words without hearing the music in the back of my head.
I think, also, that there are songs that just don't work apart from music at all. There are some songs that I love that are only a few lines long, but they work well in tandem with the melody. They may not necessarily be good poems, even if they're really great songs. Even, say, Simon and Garfunkel's "The Boxer," which I think is actually a good example of a song that could work as a poem--it would lose something without the "lie la lies" as the chorus.
I don't know if I'm making sense.
Even, say, Simon and Garfunkel's "The Boxer," which I think is actually a good example of a song that could work as a poem--it would lose something without the "lie la lies" as the chorus.
ReplyDeleteHa, this is one of my mental go-tos as well. Just writing out, the chorus looks inane, but when sung I find it very powerful and even meaningful. (Actually, this gives me an idea for a blog post...)
Songs, in a way, seem to have an advantage in that they can be sung/played in many ways to achieve different effects (I am sad that there is no duet of Eva Cassidy and Willie Nelson singing Time After Time; each of their separate versions were brilliant), whereas with poems - well, you could perhaps change the font and the arrangement of the words on the page, but it's a much simpler (though not shallower) endeavour.
Turning music into poetry involves removing an element that was intended to be there; turning poetry into music involves adding an entire dimension that was not originally intended. On one level, it seems like setting poetry to music should be far more successful.
(And then there is the other contextual element in that some poems were created to be read but some were created to be recited and I'm going to take a pause in rambling before I go crosseyed.)
I think they're interesting because the tunes sound as if they could be traditional "mountain ballads,"
ReplyDeleteI feel that way about Fleet Foxes, except instead of "mountain ballads," I think of old English folk songs. They have that haunting, lovely-sad feeling with dark fairy-tale lyrics. Same with Nick Drake, except his lyrics tend to be even darker and stranger.
From what I gather, some of Gillian Welch's songs are actual old mountain ballads. She writes a lot of her own, though.
Delete"Flashing for the warriors whose strength is not to fight
ReplyDeleteFlashing for the refugees on the unarmed road of flight"
Lovely, first time I hear this song. Thanks!